USA – -(Ammoland.com)- “Exclusive: Trump administration to announce final bump stock ban,” CNN boasted Wednesday. What was so exclusive about that, aside from sourcing the information to nameless “US officials familiar with the matter” is unclear – everyone watching developments has anticipated this happening soon due to the president’s own words in October and also due to a November 8 notice by the Office of Management and Budget noting the “Concluded Action” is “Consistent with Change.”
“Bump stocks gained national attention last year after a gunman in Las Vegas rigged his weapons with the devices to fire on concertgoers, killing 58 people,” CNN continues. If they could say that definitively, they would have an exclusive.
At this writing, assumptions by the media notwithstanding, no official statement demonstrates with certainty firearms found in the hotel room with “bump stock” devices attached were even used in the attack, making it fair to speculate if it’s also possible any weapons had been modified. What we believe probable notwithstanding, at this point we can’t say we “know” for sure. As ATF revealed in a response to a Freedom of Information Act request:
Nor can we define the scope of the “problem” nationwide in terms of how many such devices have been used in homicides (something the FBI wants no part in reporting).
“[O]pposition from lawmakers and the National Rifle Association ultimately made a regulatory change the only realistic path forward to accomplishing the President’s goal,” CNN further obfuscates. Actually, NRA signaled a green light for regulation:
“Despite the fact that the Obama administration approved the sale of bump fire stocks on at least two occasions, the National Rifle Association is calling on the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) to immediately review whether these devices comply with federal law. The NRA believes that devices designed to allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations.”
NRA wanted to avoid politicians they back being forced to go on record, and then having to reassess “A” grades and “staunch supporter of the Second Amendment” characterizations for those buckling under pressure. Either that or having their grading system held up to wider scrutiny…
It’s unclear what the president hopes to accomplish by alienating his strongest supporters at a time he is being closed in on from all sides by powers intent on destroying him. If he believes this will satisfy the gun-grabbers and make them go away, that ignores everything about their incremental tactics. Experience shows they will take a piece here and a “compromise” there, and then use that position to launch their next demand for more.
We can see it in this case already, with headlines like “Trump to Announce Bump-Stock Ban, a Largely Meaningless Gesture.” They’ll take the symbolic victory and then, emboldened and sensing weakness, circle in closer.
So what’s the big deal? Who really cares about bump stocks? I imagine those who bought the devices do, as they will be required to rid themselves of their property without compensation – or become felons subject to draconian fines and prison sentences for possessing an “unregistered machinegun,” not to mention being mandated “prohibited persons” for life, unable to ever “legally” own a gun again.
Anyone who thinks this is “just about bump stocks” is missing the point.
If President Trump gets away with this usurpation of undelegated power, guess what the Democrats will be able to pull the next time they take the White House.
About David Codrea:
David Codrea is the winner of multiple journalist awards for investigating / defending the RKBA and a long-time gun owner rights advocate who defiantly challenges the folly of citizen disarmament.
In addition to being a field editor/columnist at GUNS Magazine and a contributor to Firearms News, he blogs at “The War on Guns: Notes from the Resistance,” and posts on Twitter: @dcodrea and Facebook.
#1, the definition of an NFA was codified by the 1934 National Firearms Act. POTUS is not constitutionally empowered to unilaterally amend any act duly passed by the houses of Congress. #2, if POTUS 45 gets away with unilaterally (and extra-constitutionally) amending the 1934 NFA, there will be no power on earth with the standing to prevent POTUS 46 or 53 or 123 from unilaterally and capriciously declaring anything he wants, from water pistols to wrist rockets, to be an NFA device. #3, the NRA needs to be burned at the stake for being asleep at the wheel on this.… Read more »
Sign the petition:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/atf-being-weaponized-act-legislative-body-opposed-regulatory-agency-usurping-congressional-authority
I expect massive non-compliance. And with the ubiquity of 3D printers, the ban will be as effective as those tags you
‘re not supposed to tear off your mattress.
In blue utopias like Kalifornia you already have mass noncompliance to other restrictions. Personal sales happen every day without state sanction. Folks are in open defiance of other physical characteristics bans and restrictions. These laws are passed for two reasons: to make the law maker feel good and look good and to use selectively against ideological opponents. Public safety is not the concern nor is it the result.
Can anyone tell me how these knucklheaded dimwits will know who has a bumpstock! They are purchased as an accessory and not serialised in any way! I really doubt too many will be turning these bs in after spending 3-400$. Can’t wait too see what ban is next!
Anarchyst: Ah, no. File a Form 1 without an amnesty in place and you’ll be getting a knock on the door and have it confiscated without compensation. There is NO provision for making or registering new, transferable NFA weapons at this time. Don’t even think about it. While we’re at it, the idea of an amnesty is nice but what we should really be aiming for, as a first step, is repeal of the Hughes Amendment. The immediate effect of that would be to flood the market with transferable NRA guns and dramatically lower the prices. Please don’t preach about… Read more »
A “bump-stock” ban could be a way to open up the NFA registry to “new” machine guns. If “bump-stocks” are reclassified as “machine guns”, an amnesty period will have to be opened, as an outright ban would be a “taking” which is unconstitutional on its face. An amnesty period was declared with the 1968 “Gun Control Act”, and another amnesty limited to “Street Sweeper” shotguns was enacted in 1994. It would seem that, if “bump-stocks” are banned (or restricted) another limited “amnesty period” would be needed. Putting a “bump-stock” on your AR-15 would make it possible to register an AR-15… Read more »
Good God man. These article’s are the only ones that get such intense ramblings. O personally don’t give two chits about bump stock as I see them as a novelty item and an accessory I don’t see any real point in. Most people can’t handle engineered full auto weapons let alone some sliding stock that relies upon a loose trigger control finger slop bouncing just to cause it to fire off into the wild blue yonder. I don’t see the actual bump stock ban as an actual issue either. A resposible range would never allow it’s use. What’s worse is… Read more »
Proof! Brick do sink to the bottom and rocks are smarter. That 2A summation comment is one of the most ill-conceived statements that I’ve read here on Ammoland. This includes what comes from the a$$hat commies that squirrel in here from time-to-time.
If You Want It Straight by Robert Welch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmISzg8sjHM
> Banning a bad idea is not an infringement when the wording is simple and points to just a product and it has it’s day in a non biased court. It must not be tried as an amendment issue, but solely on the merits of the products safety and accident potential @Brick, Your argument can be turned against gun ownership in general. Who gets to decide on the merits? Who gets to decide who is an “expert?” After watching and analyzing the many bump stock videos that once existed on YouTube, I disagree with your opinions about the efficacy and… Read more »
At first, l’ll admit, l was all for a bumpstock ban. I’d never heard of them and didn’t care to own one. But then l began to see the light on a much larger canvas. Really, it’s no different from any other part, it just has a bad rap. A ban on that will lead to a ban on optics, forward grips, flashlights, lasers, stocks of all types, and pretty much any “enhancement” if we’re talking about ARs or pretty much anything semi-auto. It’s all in the works and coming to a state near you thanks to Trump and the… Read more »
Well said!
Anyone can very easily bump fire just about any firearm WITHOUT THE USE of any type of bump fire stock/device. And, while any such bump stock ban it is wholly unconstititutional (and therefore invalid), all it takes is a belt-loop, a thumb and a trigger finger to emulate the exact same thing bump stocks do. In fact, there are already numerous instructionable videos online clearly demonstrating exactly how to do it. Here are links to just a sample of those numerous instructional videos demonstrating bump firing numerous type of firearms: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RdAhTxyP64 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-nUA52BS3c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sadQjIpmOy4 People have been doing it for decades,… Read more »
Thanks Dan and Stuart! I’ll have to check those links. I’ve seen a few on YouTube. The one that l remember well is of the Slidefire from Ruger on a 10/22. Watching it run, it appears full auto but the slow-motion shows that there is a single pull of the trigger for each and every shot. I learned Ruger’s invention was banned. Worked too well!
Ltpar: The Second Amendment places no restrictions on what firearms may be owned. It simply says the “Right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed”, PERIOD. You’re a troll parading as a pro-gun poser. We get them here all the time. You don’t know the Constitution, you don’t know the law, you simply spout anti-gun talking points. Say goodbye.
@LtPar: You are either misinformed or are intentionally trying to misinform others. A Bump Fire stock does NOT turn a semiautomatic rifle into a fully automatic rifle. It still takes one pull of the trigger to fire each and every shot. And, it appears you are misinformed on the legal ownership of full auto firearms as well. They may be regulated but they are perfectly legal for law abiding citizens to own and have been since the inception of the country. In fact, there has only been one legally owned machine gun ever misused by its owner and that happened… Read more »
Someone doesn’t like negative comments about the ATF. Buncha posts whacked just now. Too bad the troll posts don’t get whacked as quickly.
How’s there only a handful of signatures on the white house petition page?
Do all you commenters read, or just flap your man pleasers? Shut your opinions off and do something halfway useful you chicken livered loud mouths sack up and sign the petition:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/atf-being-weaponized-act-legislative-body-opposed-regulatory-agency-usurping-congressional-authority
This a betrayal of trust. Bump stocks were not used in Vegas. Total BS
No, but automatic weapons were used and present. Possession of an automatic weapon without a Federal Permit is already a crime. The sole purpose of a Bump-stock is to convert a semi-automatic rifle into an automatic one. On that basis, I support prohibiting them. If you want to fire an automatic weapon, join the military and go to Afghanistan. No 2nd Amendment violation here.
@Ltpar, The many knowledgable readers, here, know that it is not a permit and is only tangential to possession. It is a tax at time of transfer. It is almost as if your legal knowledge on the subject comes from what some propagandist told you. Go read for yourself.
Why do I have have to go to Afghanistan to exercise my God given, Constitutionally protected rights?
Who are you? You are anti 2A! You sobs are the ones that need to be banned!
Trump..just why did you cave when the Democrats said no to grandfathering bump stocks in existence?..why?… when bump stocks are illegal, approx 600,000 citizens just became felons if not turned in in 90 days..believe me, ar -15s are next..mark my word wouldnt be surprised if trump does that also, to appease the dems!!!
@Dubi Nunes, The bump stock “issue” is not before the House, the Senate, or the President. It was pushed over to BATFE, who has concluded the notice and comment period, but has not proposed a rule, yet. So, no caving has been done.
Sign the petition:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/atf-being-weaponized-act-legislative-body-opposed-regulatory-agency-usurping-congressional-authority
Petition signed, which is an important reason I hawk “ammoland.com@, there are many informed, knowledgeable readers here and I gain much information and insight on “other opinions “ which is always good. While I don’t have an interest in, bump stocks, so to speak, I have a great interest in my 2cd amendment, and my God Given right to self defense. Our country is slipping over the crevice of no return, and soon we will know the mettle of many of our fellows.
President Trump is no different than any other U.S. President, in the last quarter of a century. A person who takes their political base for granted, and panders and promises to the opposition to gain some political advantage. President Trump will again claim to be a patriot and defender of the Second Amendment, when in fact he will be a Judias and sell out gun owners for a few pieces of political silver. He like all other false conservatives know he will be the lesser of evils in the next election cycle. Second Amendment advocates are the pawns on the… Read more »
As a side issue to the preceding political posts, the ATF posting in David’s article reminded me of something that has been stuck in my craw since the shooting…..and continues to this day. As far as I can determine, there has never been photos of ALL of the guns (23?) used in the shooting nor has it been reported that the ATF was eventually given permission by the local coppers to examine the guns. Feds needing permission from local cops? Not happening. I’m not a black helicopter guy (well, maybe somewhat) but I can’t get the word coverup out of… Read more »
ATF is being weaponized to act as a legislative body as opposed to a regulatory agency (Usurping Congressional authority has been published!
We the People: Your Voice in Our Government
You now have 30 days to get 99,999 signatures in order for your petition to be reviewed by the White House. Until your petition has 150 signatures, it will only be available from the following URL and will not be publicly viewable on the Open Petitions section of We the People:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/atf-being-weaponized-act-legislative-body-opposed-regulatory-agency-usurping-congressional-authority
@JAMES Kropf, Signed it and had fun searching out and signing all the other pro-Second Amendment arrest Geo. Soros, and don’t seat Maxipad Waters petitions!
Petition signed, I’m only #8 though. We need 99,992 more signatures!
I signed. Its said that the President “plays” 4 level chess, but I would have preferred that if he really has some unspecified reason to ban bump stocks that he NOT do it by re-interpreting the NFA regs. The ATF does enough of that already.
All I’ll say is Chuck Shumer will look funny with a bump stock shoved in him right where the sun don’t shine.
Chuckie is a perv-Word on the street is -he likes it like that-Him and Spartacus
for those who believed the Donald and his promises, i say, remember this in 2020. it shouldn’t be hard as this is the tip of the iceberg. how does it feel to be played? for those who called me an asshole because i believe he should be forced to release his tax returns, just like everyone else; what say you now? so glad i wasted my vote on John McCain. he doesn’t care for the everyday serf. the great protector of the 2nd A we are in for a real ride which there may be no end until the antis… Read more »
Show us the LAW that requires him to show his Tax Returns to the general public.
All he’s required to do is file with the IRS, which he has done.
95% of the people are too stupid to know what’s in his returns.
It’s a Tax return. No real science there, just basic arithmatic. So there has to be a law forcing him to show transparency now? Sounds like another excuse and evasion of what the article is about. Obama’s fault.
@Trae, No, it is only basic arithmetic if one has very simple federal taxes. Business people have very complicated federal taxes that involve obscure accounting rules (e.g. FIFO and LIFO, calendar years or fiscal years, etc).
Often times a business plan can be figured out by one’s competition by examining someone’s fed income tax, giving the competitor an unfair advantage. There are lots of legitimate reasons for FIT rules that protect people’s filings. FIT is a game between you and the government, not a team sport.
If there was a Law forcing the President to show his return to the public, then there will be a Law, forcing you to show your returns to the public.
Are you comfortable with that?
The President and all politician’s, Judges are nothing more then privet citizen’s with a government job.
You might want to READ the 4th Amendment.
Donald The 2A’s Cohen. The great ideas of banning bumpstocks and gunparts to ERPO/GVRO. I’ve been unhappy with all anti-2A products and the worst thing is I cannot return them.
Do you respect or disrespect laws that disrespects and denigrates “Our God Given Rights” ? The answer is resoundingly NO!
You do not have a “God given right” to own and possess an automatic firearm without a government permit. That is the sole purpose of a bump stock, to convert semi-automatic weapons to full automatic. You knew that before buying the damn thing, so quit sniveling.
You are clearly inexperienced at operating either one. Mechanical function is obviously not your thing. ATF said they are not a machine gun. Why don’t you read the Federal Firearms Regulations before you spout off?
@Libtpard, Yes, actually it is and one does. There is no “government permit”. It is a transfer tax. It is almost as if you do not know what a Right is. Get some education if you are going to correspond here. These people, to a very large extent, have done their foundational research.
You just look silly.
President Trump, Sir the only thing you have accomplished with the banning of Bump Stocks is the weakening of our Constitution and your own political resolve. The Democratic opposition will see your action for what it is placation and weakness of political will. Mr President your enemies will pursue you you unmercifully regardless of softening your position on the Second Amendment. The unloyal opposition will attempt impeachment proceedings with the coming new year. President Trump if and when this happens don’t look to the support of defenders of the Second Amendment, for we will not support those who do not… Read more »
Sounds like you are a bit brainwashed. here is no 2nd Amendment right to posses an automatic weapon and in fact, the Law confirms that. If the so called 2nd Amendment crowd went off the cliff, would you blindly follow them?
Ltpar
A free people ought not only be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government!
— GEORGE WASHINGTON —
If you do not understand that, it means that the citizens of this country should have arms (weapons) and ammunition of equal or more power than the government!
Watched a video on Legally Armed America where the host had a copy of a letter from the ATF stating they had no jurisdiction on bump stocks. How did they all of a sudden get it?
Not the BATFE…Its the State Dept.
It appears to me that Trump is now showing what so many of us knew a long time ago. He has never been a constitutionalist. Because of several of his policy beliefs. I believe he can be more accurately described as a socialist. Is this the beginning of the end of our Second Amendment? Why didn’t he add the bump stock to the Federal list that pertains to fully automatic weapons? Why, and I’d love to see this implemented. A Federal law which made it an automatic fast track death penalty for anyone using a bump stock or any fully… Read more »
The beginning of the end of the 2nd amendment took place in 1903 with the “Dick” act eviscerating the whole amendment by making the first 13 words of the 2nd amendment meaningless.
impeachment is a sure answer to this problem. never thought i’d feel this way. just “grab em by the pussy”.
OK, genius, your non-vote is exactly the same as voting for the Democrat liberal. Allow them in office and see what draconian measures on gun control they will implement. I support the 2nd Amendment but with conditions. The gun laws need to be overhauled to make it harder for those who should not possess a firearm to do so.
For what it is worth… When people disagree about an issue. The final outcome will usually follow this way. If one side is happy with everything, somebody got screwed. If both sides are unhappy over it, then it was probably fair. When it is over, if we get to keep our AR’s, be happy. A bump stock is not a firearm. Accessories are not mentioned in the second amendment. I know that someone will say that is only the beginning. That is why the fight will go on. However, in any fight there are always casualties.
@HinO, I see by your statement, “Accessories are not mentioned in the second amendment.” that you are no constitutional scholar. The founders were not required to express any part of the Constitution in a way that you would prefer, these two hundred years later. The founders chose the broadly inclusive term “arms”. That includes parts.
Thanks Bill, you beat me to it. It’s amazing how so many people are willing to parse so many words and allow our freedoms to be slowly but surely chipped away, starting with the NFA in 1934 as one of the first major chips in the foundation of our freedoms.
I’m happy I’m at the age I’m at so, hopefully, I won’t have to witness the final extinction, and, eventual uprising that will follow, of our Rights. It won’t be pretty and anyone who says they’re looking forward to it is either stupid or simply an Internet blowhard.
I have a plan.
Yes, and I hope it reads like this: ‘I shall not seek nor shall I accept my party’s nomination to be your Commander in Chief.” LBJ redux
@mrringlee, I am so glad that you asked, m r. Its called the whole new Congress plan. Only those that actually work for a living are allowed to serve the American people in Congress or in the office of president.
@m.r.ringlee, I did not realize that the work requirement, of my plan, would preclude you from running. My apologies.
“When it is over, if we get to keep our AR’s, be happy.” Yeah, and eastern European Jews should have been happy they didn’t have to walk to the concentration camps? The Cherokee people should have been happy some of them survived The Trail Of Tears? Bataan Death March prisoners should have been happy to receive their daily bowl of gruel? WWII era Japanese Americans should have happy to receive free government housing? Tea Party Patriots should have been happy it only took five years and exorbitant legal fees to receive their tax exempt status from beneficent federal bureaucrats? Oliver… Read more »
When Donald Trump was running for President during one of his debates He made the statement ” If I am elected as your President I will follow the United States Constitution to the letter”. This statement is the main reason that I voted for Him to be our President.. Now I see that he is allowing other individuals or groups to alter his promise to follow the Constitution to the letter. Once he was elected President I was so happy and I expected Him to make every State in the United States a Constitutional Carry State but that hasn’t happened… Read more »
Don’t be too disappointed, Trump only signs the bill to authorize reciprocity into law after the Senate passes it, which they have. The bill has been approved by the House for a few months. We are waiting on the Senate to act not Trump. Time to think about term limits.
Sure looks like the President is upholding the Constitution to me. Where in the Constitution or the 2nd Amendment does it say people are permitted to possess automatic weapons? With all the gun violence, some gun control needs to be implemented without restricting rights of gun owners. Possession of an automatic weapon is not one of those rights.
@Ltpar, You ask, “Where in the Constitution or the 2nd Amendment does it say people are permitted to possess automatic weapons?” See the word “arms” that is where. But you will never find the word “permitted in the Second Amendment”. Nor can some gun control be implemented without restricting the Constitutional Civil Rights of gun wonders.
Possession and ownership is part of that Constitutional Civil Right. I was shopping for a full auto on gunbroker just a couple hours ago.
Your knowledge of the Constitution is unsat.
If not us ,than who?if not now ,then when?1776 / FREEDOM AINT FREE/
never has been
Anybody that’s ever used one of those bumps stocks knows they are just a gimmick and hard on the receiving weapon Rapidfire is much easily accessed by trigger manipulation or by upgrading to Cassette drop in type or binary type trigger systems which is easy on the weapon versus a damn bump stock I’ll tell you one thing trading could be good if we could trade the bump stock ban to receive the border wall I’d be all in for that If Feinstein and swallow well were thrown into the foundationThat would just be icing on the cake
Ansel is right, it’s past time we refresh the tree of liberty. But as much as I want to take issue with politicians, I must leave that for another day. My problem is with the weaselzippered surrender monkeys known as the NRA. The NRA has done JACK SQUAT about truly defending our gun rights. They’re a gun control group masquerading as a champion of gun rights… THEY’RE NOT. It is others like GUN OWNERS OF AMERICA who are doing the heavy lifting, most of which NRA falsely take credit for. Gun owners who actually care about gun rights have to… Read more »
OOH-RAH.
The exact reason I stopped supporting the NRA and Joined the GOA.
People are far better off supporting the GOA instead of the NRA.
Supporting the NRA is like buying a product just because of it’s name brand, better products out there, that are just as good.
Sgt., with all due respect, I see nothing wrong with supporting multiple organizations, each attacking problems from different angles. In so doing, we’ll be much more effective as a community, by maintaining active and participative membership in the largest and most well-known 2A organization. With our membership, we can lobby for change from within, rather than throw bombshells over self imposed walls of division and discord in a self-defeating internecine bloodbath in which the only victors are Bloomberg, Soros, Steyer, Gifford and their anti-American ilk! Now is NOT the time to embrace civil strife between pro-Second Amendment patriots but to… Read more »
Cal, did you NOT just read everything I had to say??? NRA is USELESS, and because people like YOU insist on sticking with NRA, they’re the 800-lb gorilla that gets the attention of the President and Congress whenever they want to gin up some gunowner fear BY STABBING US IN OUR COLLECTIVE BACKS YET AGAIN!
Like I said, if everyone in the NRA would back GOA instead, I GUARANTEE YOU the situation would change!!! So take that “let’s not have strife between pro-2A patriots” BS and SHOVE IT, because when you say “with all due respect”, you’re REALLY SAYING “G.F.Y.”!
Sorry you feel that way. Just to reiterate, I am a GOA member and supporter and share your view they are the most politically pure 2A group, especially compared to the NRA. The NRA still does good work however, in areas GOA doesnt: training, law enforcement, childhood info mtls, etc. and as such reach audiences unavailable to other 2A groups.
One thing that the NRA won’t address is the fact they were supportive of the Dick act back in 1903 which basically made the first 13 words of the 2nd amendment null and void. Read Dr. Edwin Vierra’s “Thirteen Words”. It explains WHY “they” have such control between that act and the totally unconstitutional federal reserve act we’ve been in a world of hurt ever since. And finally as things all go to hell in a hand-basket folks are starting to realize WHY. The NRA won’t even mention the power of the jury via Jury Nullification either. GOA stands in… Read more »
Here, Here!
Anyone who thinks politicians are listening to us is mistaken. Anyone who thinks the voting process is honest and secure needs their head examined.
If you have a barn that’s infested with rats just asking them to leave won’t work. #refreshthetreeofliberty